Monday, May 21, 2007

Muddled thinking

Two overs, two wickets, declaration - the whole point of this exercise was what?

Posted by Homer at 5/21/2007 12:18:00 AM

36 comments:

Anonymous said...

To make sure that before the england series , you dont oversleep :)

12:43 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

Whole point of exercise?

To assert once again what a big idiot Dravid is!!

12:43 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

Oh, so RP "rubbish" Singh takes a wicket afterall!!

12:55 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

Oh my!! Another wicket!!!!

12:56 AM, May 21, 2007
Kartikeya Date said...

RP hasnt bowled badly... hes worked up some good pace....

I think it was obvious what the plan was in the morning - the key was Dhoni. They were willing to play on for some quick runs from Dhoni. The minute he was dismissed, that was it.

3:57 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

Khan disappointed hugely. Had Kumble been here, we COULD HAVE bundled them up for 150 or so. But whats the point left in the match.

BD trails by 149 after 1st innings. But so what???????

Whan can India do?

6:51 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

This has been worst day for India. First they couldn't stop the sloggers Mortaza and Hussain, Dravid didn't give Sachin a chance to break their partnership and then Jaffer became the only batsman to be dismissed on a pair vs BD, then our tactically astute captain departed for just 2 runs, leaving the team in tatters at 6/2 with only 2 more specialist batsmen to come!!

Rubbish captaincy!!

8:18 AM, May 21, 2007
Anonymous said...

With due (and more) respect, Chandan , whats "astute" captaincy got to do with a dismissal for 2 runs? Would his captaincy have been better if he'd got hundred?

8:24 AM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

I will be interested in understanding how a team can progress from 122/7 to 238/10 in a space of 26 overs..

How exactly can we lose our grip on a test in this manner?

8:51 AM, May 21, 2007
Anonymous said...

Its nothing new...history of Indian cricket is full of these situations when India reaped thru top order only to bcom freeze on tailer's slog.

our bowlers just can use thier mind and it seems that they dont have alternative thinking...either they will be taking wickets or they will be going for runs a plenty nothing in between. i am afraid whether they know things like slowing down game...tightening lengths...not even our 'astute captain' he kust wants to go by book no innovative thinking just going thru plain theory...

how much i respect dravid for his batting and i am his ardent fan...but even i am flummoxed by dravid "the captain"...

9:08 AM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

And thats ridiculous isnt it Pankaj.. We do all the hard work to wrest the initiative and then hand it right back..

BD al out 180 versus BD all out 238 could be the difference between a win and a draw.

9:46 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

Sfx,

I've been stung by his moves todays. He decided not to play the 6th batsman. So message was obviously clear to every other 5 batsman and that was to take more responsibility to cover up for the long tail.

Still your no.#1 bat goes for a pair. What should you do? Play like you did in the 1st inning--that is risk free cricket. But no. He went for the shot which was in air and was dramatically caught.

So two batsmen go cheaply. Who'll cover up for the tail?

9:51 AM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

btw, did we take the offer for light or was it the end of the day's play?

9:55 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

Light offered. It was extremely dark there. There was no point in losing another wicket today because of not sighting it.

10:36 AM, May 21, 2007
Unknown said...

Giving Sachin only 4 overs in spite of Kumble's absence was one of Dravid's mistakes. But what can you expect from a guy whose whole approach is conservative. He can only be successful if everything goes according to Plan A. No Kumble, no Plan B.

10:39 AM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

Chandan,

early start tomorrow?

10:44 AM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

Sumit,

Something similar happened in the third test at Newlands- so whither process?

10:46 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

Homer,

Even today we were to start half an hr earlier but started at the usual time because Sun had not dried the outfield completely by 9.30 local time.

Let us hope that ground is ready by 9.30 tomorrow. but there is little chance of that. The cloud in the evening was looking ominous.

And what is left in this match, now? We may as well keep batting!

11:03 AM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

Chandan,

which then begs the question - why did we declare when we did in the first essay?

The whole thinking in this test has been muddled- do we attack, do we defend, do we push forward, do we fall back, do we hold. No one seems to know what our MO is ( including the captain)

11:08 AM, May 21, 2007
Anonymous said...

FWIW

http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/5day.shtml?world=2122

11:10 AM, May 21, 2007
Anonymous said...

FWIW

http://weather.yahoo.com/forecast/BGXX0002.html

11:12 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

Thanks Sfx.

So no play likely tomorrow?

11:27 AM, May 21, 2007
Unknown said...

Homer, More on our conservatism in the comments at my blog post What good is a coach, anyway?

11:30 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

Homer,

MO is decided in the dressing room before the match. There should be at least 3 plans, considering the situations. The bowlers should know what to do before they go out in the field!

I wish I could mail Dravid and ask his views!

11:43 AM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

Chandan,

Is that the case? Or as with everything about our cricket we wing it as we go along?

11:53 AM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

It looks as if we do like that. But if true, it'll be unbelievable in this modern day where everything is planned beforehand!

1:01 PM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

chandan,

maybe the approach to planning is what is at fault

1:08 PM, May 21, 2007
Kartikeya Date said...

Some scathing commentary there.... with not a little bit of contemptuous sarcasm....

I guess a counter attack by one of the worlds most promising young cricketers does that to you.

Lets give credit where it is due - Mortaza played brilliantly on a flat wicket which had nothing in it for either pace or spin.

India's decision to play the extra bowler in this weather was vindicated, though sadly for Kumble he has to stay bundled up in a sick bed instead of picking up some easy minnow scalps.

The bowling, especially RP Singh was pretty good - just shows why RP had a county offer before his selection to the Indian side for this tour. After today, he's definitely going to England. VRV is probably not going to make it. Zaheer showed why hes averaged 36 with the ball in Test Cricket, and why he's unlikely to improve significantly.

I thought the captaincy was good... but the bowling was limited. 122/7 on this wicket was a function of some silly batting by the BD batting line up more than anything else. This was a 280 wicket for Bangladesh. If you look at the scores Bangladesh have achieved in Bangladesh against SL and Aus in Bangladesh(superior bowling line ups to this Indian one) - then they are

319, 181, 235, 201, 427, 148, 197, 304.

They've lost all four of these Tests. But 238 on what was effectively a day 2 wicket by a rookie attack was a great effort.

If you expect all 11 to put on a no show, then im afraid your expectations are unrealistic.

2:49 PM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

Kartikeya,

For better or worse, because of our bowling and fielding skills or Bangladeshi ineptitude, we had them at 122/7 and later 149/8.

Granted too that not everyone of the XI is going to roll over and play dead, that there will be some resistance from a couple of the players.

But did conditions change so dramatically that numbers 9 and 10 could stitch together a partnership of 77 runs over 18 overs?

And how could we not control either the run flow or the tempo over this period?

And then that it turn begs the question - was someone asleep at the wheel?

Did we get so overconfident when the 8th wicket fell that we took our eyes of the ball and allowed the Bangladeshis to get out of jail? And if we did, where does the onus lie?

Sure the Bangladeshis dug deep, and hats off to them. But we abetted this.

The bowling was not limited when we took 149/8. Nor was it limited when we took the last two wickets for 8.

So what happened in between? Collective amnesia? Over confidence? Bad captaincy?

3:40 PM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

At 122/7, BD required 66 runs to avoid the follow on.

At 149/8, they needed 39 more.

Between then and the time the 9th wicket fell, BD had scored 77 runs in 18 overs at 4.27 rpo.

At 122/7 and later 149/8, were the Indians thinking that they sit tight and force the Bangladeshis into mistakes or was the thinking that it is just a matter or running in and bowling , that the two wickets should be a walk in the park?

And if it was the latter, what do u say about the leadership?

3:47 PM, May 21, 2007
Kartikeya Date said...

Nothing... i would give credit to the batting.

Again... you can't nitpick tactics.

I think Dravid is a good captain and has achieved excellent results given the resources he has at his command. He is more aggressive that Ganguly in terms of strategy.

Whether or not a captain should occasionally sit back and create a stalemate is debatable.

Of the 39 runs that Bangladesh wanted, 27 came in 3 overs. Until then 7 overs had yielded 12 runs.

As in the case of selection, captains are restrained by what their players can actually do.

5:03 PM, May 21, 2007
Kartikeya Date said...

Ramesh Powar was taken off after 6 overs and replaced with Tendulkar... 6 overs is a very short spell for a spinner.

Dravid was also rotating his pacemen at the other end, trying to get VRV to take the late wickets, because he wanted to preserve RP and Zaheer for the new ball if the follow on became possible.

But Mortaza played well and there was no deviation off the wicket to beat a determined dead defensive bat.

You can't nitpick all the time... in my view this notion of a "great captain" is a myth. Some captains are aggressive while others are defensive... is one better than the other? Thats a matter of opinion.

In any case, a tactical decision does not reflect on "leadership" in my view. A tactical decision reflects a read of the match situation and little more.

5:19 PM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

Kartikeya,

And that is what defines good captaincy isn't it- the read of the match situation and the reaction to it.

As regards tactical decisions not a reflection of leadership, obviously the 12th man does not make the calls from the confines of the dressing room - it is the captain who calls the shots.

The captain may or may not choose to involve other players in the decision making process, that remains the prerogative of the captain.

5:27 PM, May 21, 2007
Homer said...

Kartikeya,

Also, the 24 of the 27 runs came after the follow on had been avoided.

Infact the Bangladeshis got from 169 to 218 in the span of 5 overs.

5:35 PM, May 21, 2007
Kartikeya Date said...

Homer... everybody can read a match situation.... if you can read it, do you seriously think Rahul Dravid can't? If you can think of a correct reaction..... do you think he can't?

9:24 PM, May 21, 2007
Chandan said...

I ask you a simple question then Kartikeya? Why was Sachin not given an over before the follow on was averted?

11:48 PM, May 21, 2007

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